tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-53246864840716464.post6870574908663240275..comments2024-02-29T00:46:38.800-08:00Comments on Washingtons Blog: U.S. Government Used COMMUNIST Torture Techniques Specifically Designed to Produce FALSE ConfessionsUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-53246864840716464.post-2612390502924322222011-05-19T01:21:07.612-07:002011-05-19T01:21:07.612-07:00More recently, mostly after 9/11 but to some degre...More recently, mostly after 9/11 but to some degree before this too, the basic techniques the CIA first studied in MKULTRA, the simpler North Korean/Chinese methods of torture and physical and psychological abuse, were "re-purposed" (though under orders from Bush Jr., Cheney, etc.) for use on so-called enemy combatants, both by the CIA, and other branches of the military, in order to generate false intelligence, and maybe get a few useful pieces of information in the process. The CIA had long ago found these original methods were the simplest, easiest, cheapest to implement in the field, etc., rather than some of the elaborate methods they also experimented with (though some of those techniques were also probably found to have their uses). The CIA has had a lot of experience over the decades with what results are gotten when specific methods are used--a trove of techniques they didn't want to throw away--so that much of the torture and other uses of force they've engaged in, in the past decade or so, has been fairly formulaic, at least in their estimation, even when it seems to resemble mayhem. The only saving grace of the people who have actually performed these techniques in recent years, is that many of them point out that they still don't work nearly often enough to justify their use, and that they performed these acts because they were ordered to do so by the chain of command--they couldn't even rely on the military laws that dictate that people in the military are to obey only lawful orders, because Yoo, etc. worked with the Bush Jr. administration to make torture quasi-legal, and hence if they'd disobeyed, they would have been subject to the full weight of military prosecution.John Sawyerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11635133938408075683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-53246864840716464.post-31339988964193665452011-05-19T01:20:01.195-07:002011-05-19T01:20:01.195-07:00I should point out some old news, but it bears rep...I should point out some old news, but it bears repeating: the CIA began experimenting with techniques of interrogation, mind control, influence, performance enhancement and degradation, etc. (sometimes involving torture and generally brutal treatment) shortly after WWII in collaboration with Nazi scientists, but ramped up this project starting in the 1950s, "inspired" (as this washingtonsblog post points out) by techniques used on American prisoners during the Korean War (fearing a "mind control gap"). This program soon became MKULTRA, which involved the collaboration of psychologists, universities, medical institutes, etc. in Canada and England.<br /><br />When they were investigated in the 1970s, the CIA claimed they found that almost none of this worked reliably or often enough to be useful, and so they claim to have shelved MKULTRA and all its projects. I suspect that "almost" may be the key word--it would be worth finding out if they discovered that if they had enough people to put through the grinding wheel, they'd produce a few desirable products, either for their original goals, and/or for other purposes discovered along the way. Speculating, this may be one of the reasons most of the documentation was destroyed in the 1970s--they may have wanted to minimize the chances that people would know that, in the CIA's estimation, MKULTRA got results (of whatever sort they found useful) often enough for CIA purposes. If the public had known this was the CIA's true conclusion, more people would have realized the CIA was probably putting the results of the experiments to use, or at least keeping the techniques in storage until some future date, and hence the public would have called for more scrutiny of the CIA earlier.<br /><br />Some of the little surviving documentation on MKULTRA, and eyewitness testimony, also uses phrases like those used by Jessen, when he says the goal is for the detainee "to see that [the detainer] has 'total' control of you because you are completely dependent on him, and thus you must comply with his wishes. Therefore, it is absolutely inevitable that you must cooperate with him in some way (propaganda, special favors, confession, etc.)." As most people know, there was even a popular book and a film on some of the wilder extrapolations: "The Manchurian Candidate". The problem with that portrayal (in addition to being something of a red herring promoted by the CIA to draw attention away from MKULTRA's other projects), as with other portrayals for years after, was that even after the Korean War, they ominously portrayed other countries as possibly continuing to use these techniques against the US, when it was actually the US that began experimenting with these and more advanced methods, and possibly putting them into practice, on a scale beyond that used by the North Koreans and Chinese. The "war on terror" has produced a huge number of test subjects for fine-tuning the techniques further, far beyond the numbers the CIA could get its hands on for MKULTRA, so that the total number of "successes" may be greater.<br /><br />(more)John Sawyerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11635133938408075683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-53246864840716464.post-88662304399537528202011-05-14T09:45:42.584-07:002011-05-14T09:45:42.584-07:00Although I neither have first-hand experience nor ...Although I neither have first-hand experience nor research to support this notion, I strongly suspect that since time immemorial, certain forces of EVERY state have used tactics which clearly constituted torture (no matter how defined) and shocked the conscience, although many (for various reasons) have chosen not to do so openly. <br /><br />However, that we live in a society capable of public introspection may be just good enough, for now, especially with other issues on our plate. <br />It’s what helps form the “collective conscience” that all societies need, but do not have.Inspector Clouseauhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09373932797333038561noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-53246864840716464.post-500455581704069402011-05-10T11:23:15.092-07:002011-05-10T11:23:15.092-07:00"At his best, man is the noblest of all anima..."At his best, man is the noblest of all animals; separated from law and justice he is the worst".--Aristotlewindcatcherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01472629221573977747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-53246864840716464.post-56108260370791454332011-05-10T04:52:06.189-07:002011-05-10T04:52:06.189-07:00remember all the kangaroo court "confessions&...remember all the kangaroo court "confessions" in the last 10 yearsryanshaunkellyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15212679784122486561noreply@blogger.com